A&A Market Garden Interest-Ideas

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matsterman
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A&A Market Garden Interest-Ideas

Post by matsterman » Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:20 am

Though it wasn't too far from an allied Victory(basically a mile away), it probably is one of the most intriguing battles of the war.

You figure a ten round game, obviously, it gets ugly for the allies if you dont win by round 4 to 6.

Weather would be a major factor as far as reinforcements go for the Brits. I would probably guess you would have to use a card system, reference AA D-Day, and a dice roll to determine the weather in England each day.

You could introduce the transport plane and base a flak card/turn each round to see how many you lose.

Axis options:

Obviously, the longer you last, the more chance you have of winning.

You would only be allowed to blow a bridge in say round one or two, and you would have to occupy the block to blow it. That means, if the game starts with allied airborne occupying nijmagen or arnhem, it would be very difficult for the axis to be able to control those zones, but smaller zones, aka Son or Grave, would be easier for the germans to occupy and blow a bridge.

It would be a very good game I would think.

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Post by Imperious leader » Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:22 am

I think its too close to Bulge and D-day. Their are more important battles ans all of these always seem the be freaking America/British. Lets do a different game featuring the eastern front where the REAL war was won and lost.

Their is no greater battle than Stalingrad and Kursk. All the previous games by comparison are dealing with important but nothing that had any impact on the general conduct of the war.

only Japans attack on Hawaii, Stalingrad, Kursk, Midway, France 1940, Battle of Britain had great influence on the overall outcome of future events.

El Alamein was not a turning point but a last gasp effort to stab at the British who were already going to the offensive and had no impact on the war unless Rommel broke into Persia... and Hitler never committed the adequate resources to do this because of his campaign in Russia. Panzer Army Africa was nothing more than a glorified corps level formation backed up by demoralized Italian fodder, where the Soviet Union Featured 3 million Germans against 5 million Russians. Its a no brainer that the real war was fought here and to keep ignoring this is a falicy into thinking the Soviet contribution had little impact on the war.

The idea of these games among other things is to teach history and nobody is ever gonna learn anything if we keep telling people that all these late war battles were the "deciding point of world war two"

Its all bogus. The Soviets need a chance to set the record straight and where people can appreciate their sacrifice was the most important contribution by far. The Soviets absorbed 85% of the total German military effort in the war. Lets get real.
We really need an Axis and Allies World War one game so i can play that on August 1st, 2014.

bobthefish
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Post by bobthefish » Fri Dec 07, 2007 3:35 am

I really like the idea of this game as well. I think it would be really cool to see preferably a North Africa game, or maybe even an Easter Front game that could start at any number of times but rather than having set reinforments you could choose to have a production system. I know both ideas have already been presented but I like the idea of all three games.

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Post by Sergente_nella_neve » Fri Dec 07, 2007 9:33 am

I agree with IL, the eastern front was the real place were the WW2 was decided.

But i think that a game about Barbarossa or the entire russian campaign would be too "big" for new games based on a tactic scale. Indeed, if you want to play the eastern campaign, it's already existing a game about this, it's name is "Axis and Allies: Europe"...

No, i think that new tactical games would be more "little", but not so little like a single battle. D-Day, Battle of the Bulge and Guadalcanal are perfect for this, and perfect too can be a Stalingrad game, or a North-African game, but not a game based on the war in the entire eastern front.

I think also that "Europe" would be a greeeat game, but it have the necessity of a complete revision. "Advanced Europe" seems to be in the correct way.
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ChristophfromGermany
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Thats what I say all the time

Post by ChristophfromGermany » Tue Dec 11, 2007 8:08 am

Hi folks,

I totally agree with IL (as always :D ). Stalingrad was the battle that finally stopped the German advance into Russia, from Kursk led the road straight to Berlin. My favourite is Stalingrad, as it is the more complex battle. As I mentioned in another thread before, I would like to see a game that stretches from the German advance in August 1942 till the end in January 1943. The German players task would be to conquer the city before winter begins (end of turn 8 in a 12 turn game), the Russian players task would be to prevent this from happening and reconquer all of the city till the end of the game (after 12 rounds). Otherwise Germany wins.
The basic setup should see a strong German player at the start, while Russia grows stronger through bigger reinforcements. Supply and reinforcement is a big issue of course. Russia can reinforce only through the strategical important landing points in central Stalingrad, once winter sets in, troops can easily bridge the Wolga at any point on the map.
The map itself should cover the city (somehow enlarged in scale to allow different city territories like Mamaev hill, the Red October factory, the Silo in southern Stalingrad and central Stalingrad with landing points) and the western area of the city, including Gumrak, Pitomnik (airfields for German supplies) and Kalatsh (where Russian troops met at Operation Uranus).
City areas should boost the defense value of infantry from 2 to 3 or decrease the attack value of tanks from 3 to 2 (or both?), as ruins were easier to defend.

I just ordered my copy of Guadalcanal and I look forward to playing it, but as you should always keep an eye on future developments, I would love to play A&A Stalingrad rather sooner than later.
ChristophfromGermany

No decent man can prefer war to peace, because at peace-time the sons burry their father while at war, the father burries his sons. (Herodot)

templeton
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Post by templeton » Tue Dec 11, 2007 1:15 pm

There is already Monty's Gamble, Market Garden by MMP - which is quick playing, and not to complex.

matsterman
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Post by matsterman » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:44 pm

just because someone else did it poorly, doesn't mean it cant be done right.

As far as plans go for a campaign, it's tough to argue that Market Garden had to have been one of the most complex. You have to coordinate airdrops, grabbing bridges, holding drop zones, etc.

You look in the history of military games, both on computer and boardgames, they have always done Market Garden due to its complexity and its ability for the outcome to turn at any time.

With Larry at the helm, you could have a seriously done game...

Dagon81
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Post by Dagon81 » Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:34 am

matsterman wrote:
You look in the history of military games, both on computer and boardgames, they have always done Market Garden due to its complexity and its ability for the outcome to turn at any time.
Russians dont make computer games... sooooo its normal that military computer games show a priority for the Western Allies battles... You dont see African countries civil wars portrayed in boardgames or computer games... but they exist and much more people dies there than in the wartime Iraq... and still you see Iraq campaigns portrayed in games...

These games have a specific public...where the money is and only battles significant for such countries show up in games... its obvious!

Lets face it...American propaganda is great! They turn "secondary" battles into major-hyper-super-conflicts... but only if you buy it!!!
Come on!!! just look at the numbers... you dont see those many casualties, divisions and such in western front...

Some time ago I started a topic about the Battle of the bulge and the Avalon Hill's title of such battle: "A Desperate Struggle for Victory in the Most Brutal Conflict of WWII " :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: LMAO!!! This shows you exactly what I mean...

I would even like to see a Chinese-Japanese WWII theater, but... who would buy such a game?

I believe the Market Garden Op makes a nice game too, but lets give a chance first to a eastern front or north africa game.

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